Diane DiResta: Speaking In Soundbites for Lawyers

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Diane DiResta discuss:

  • The value of speaking both in person and virtually.
  • Common mistakes lawyers make when speaking.
  • Understanding your audience.
  • What to do when you’re nervous (and why those nerves are selfish).

Key Takeaways:

  • Fit is often about culture, not about a skill mismatch.
  • It doesn’t matter if you are a fast speaker, you want to leave space in between – remember the pause. That is where the information you are sharing is going to land with the audience.
  • Speaking is 90% preparation and 10% delivery – the price you charge is for more than the 1 hour of your time to give the presentation.
  • Group things into 3 – it is more memorable. Stories also are memorable and touch the heart.

“Speaking is one of the most powerful and cost-effective marketing tools you can have.  It’s like test driving a car, they get to see you in action.” —  Diane DiResta

Get a free copy of Steve’s book “Sales-Free Selling” here: https://www.fretzin.com/sales-free-selling

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Episode References: 

About Diane DiResta: Diane DiResta, CSP, is Founder and CEO of DiResta Communications, Inc., a New York City consultancy serving business leaders who deliver high-stakes presentations— whether one-to-one, in front of a crowd, or from a virtual platform. DiResta is the author of Knockout Presentations: How to Deliver Your Message with Power, Punch, and Pizzazz, an Amazon.com category best-seller, and has spoken on 4 continents. She works with lawyers and leaders to speak with confidence, clarity, and exude executive presence. Diane is Past President of the NYC chapter of National Speakers Association and former media trainer for the NBA and WNBA. She was featured on CNN, and quoted in the NY Times, Wall Street Journal, London Guardian, and Investors Business Daily, and Bloomberg radio. Diane is a Certified Speaking Professional, a designation held by less than 12% of speakers nationwide. She is a Certified Virtual Presenter. And her blog, Knockout Presentations, made the Top 50 Public Speaking blogs.

Diane is Past President of the NYC chapter of National Speakers Association and former media trainer for the NBA and WNBA. She was featured on CNN, and quoted in the NY Times, Wall Street Journal, London Guardian, and Investors Business Daily, and Bloomberg radio. Diane is a Certified Speaking Professional, a designation held by less than 12% of speakers nationwide. She is a Certified Virtual Presenter. Her LinkedIn Learning course Speaking Confidently and Effectively made the Top 20 Most Popular courses for two consecutive years.

Connect with Diane DiResta: 

Website: https://www.diresta.com/

Book: Knockout Presentations: How to Deliver Your Message with Power, Punch, and Pizzazz

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dianediresta

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/diresta-communications-inc-

Twitter: https://twitter.com/speakingpro

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/diane.diresta/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/dianediresta

Connect with Steve Fretzin:

LinkedIn: Steve Fretzin

Twitter: @stevefretzin

Instagram: @fretzinsteve

Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.

Website: Fretzin.com

Email: Steve@Fretzin.com

Book: Legal Business Development Isn’t Rocket Science and more!

YouTube: Steve Fretzin

Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Show notes by Podcastologist Chelsea Taylor-Sturkie

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You’re the expert. Your podcast will prove it.


[00:00:00] Steve Fretzin: Hello, everyone. Have you ever wondered how much more business you could be generating each month? Well, you can take the Be That Lawyer challenge to find out. If I’m unable to help you find the money that’s been evading you, I’ll pay your hourly rate for the time invested together. Just go to Fretzin. com to sign up. I’m challenging you. Now enjoy the show.

[00:00:23] Narrator: You’re listening to Be That Lawyer, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Each episode, your host, author, and Fretzin, will take a deeper dive helping you grow your law practice in less time with greater results. Now, here’s your host.

[00:00:45] Steve Fretzin: Well, hey, everybody, welcome to Be That Lawyer. I am Steve Fretzin. As the announcer mentioned, if you’ve been listening to the show, wow, we’ve hit over a hundred thousand downloads and we are absolutely rocking it, doing two shows a week, having a great time. And again, my goal is to bring you the most amazing guest interview that are going to help you to be that lawyer, someone who’s confident, organized, rainmaker.

[00:01:06] Steve Fretzin: Today’s no different. Diane’s in the wings. How you doing, Diane? Hi, good. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Happy to have you. And, uh, we had such a lovely chat, kind of a pre interview, you know, ramble to kind of figure out what we’re going to talk about today. And I’m excited to get into the weeds with you. We always start with our quote of the show and I really enjoyed yours.

[00:01:26] Steve Fretzin: And let me just hit that real quick. That is a quitter never wins. A winner never quits. And I’ve heard that before. Do you know who said that? Is it just like an old adage?

[00:01:36] Diane DiResta: I don’t know who said it, but it was what I chose to have in my high school yearbook. And I chose it because I really resonate with it.

[00:01:44] Diane DiResta: I have a lot of perseverance and I believe that that’s true. Quote to live by.

[00:01:50] Steve Fretzin: You know, I will, I will add something though. That, there’s a book that came out years ago that I enjoyed. It was about the power of quitting. And what it really was talking about was that if there’s something that you feel like you have to stay with because you started it, that isn’t necessarily the best idea.

[00:02:08] Steve Fretzin: Like if I started taking drum lessons, I realized I don’t really have an affinity for it. I’m 50 years old. Do I really care about drums? I’ve got more important things to do. It’s okay to quit. I think it’s about the things that are most important in your life. That really is where quitting and not quitting is really comes in handy.

[00:02:24] Steve Fretzin: Absolutely.

[00:02:25] Diane DiResta: You can always go in a new direction. You might be going down one path and they decide there’s something that’s better. So absolutely. But it’s not giving up on your goal, on your dream, staying the course when it’s important to you. And there’s certain things that you should get rid of. If it’s a relationship gone bad, quit, hang on something that’s not working.

[00:02:46] Diane DiResta: But, but for something that’s really important to you, as you said, Winner never wins, the winner never quits. You just stay on course. Yeah. The other

[00:02:55] Steve Fretzin: one that I hear is, you know, follow your passion. And then I don’t know who this was, if it was Sennac or somebody that said, follow your skill or follow your, like your, what your natural affinity is.

[00:03:07] Steve Fretzin: Like we all have passions. I’m passionate about some sports I play. I’m never, I don’t want to be a pro at it. Like I don’t want to have to do that, but I, my interest is business development and helping lawyers. And I love writing about it. I love speaking about it. I love, you know, every day I get to spend with my clients.

[00:03:24] Steve Fretzin: It’s become my passion. I think it started as a skill and it’s become my passion. I think that’s also, you know, another piece of this. And we’re just going into multiple potential quotes at this point. Well,

[00:03:34] Diane DiResta: it’s interesting that you say that, Steve, because there’s a speaker named Terri Traspisio, and she did a TEDx talk called Unfollow Your Passion.

[00:03:42] Diane DiResta: And it’s her whole story about, don’t follow your passion, just get an action, get a job. And that she told her story about how one job led to another, to another, to her current career. So yeah, I think the passion’s good. But don’t let it lead

[00:03:56] Steve Fretzin: you. Yeah, I like that. I like that a lot. And give us a little bit of a flavor of your background.

[00:04:01] Steve Fretzin: You’re, uh, Diane DiResta. You’re the founder, um, and president of DiResta Communications. You’re also the author of Knockout Presentations. Talk to us about your, where you started and how you ended up where you, where you are.

[00:04:14] Diane DiResta: I started as a speech pathologist. So I got my master’s at Columbia and I worked in the New York City.

[00:04:19] Diane DiResta: Board of education for about eight years have the scars to prove it. Just kidding. It was actually good. But at a certain point, I realized that there was no career path. And so I found a job in the New York Times doing standup training for a company that did public speaking. And that was my foray into business.

[00:04:37] Diane DiResta: And then from there, I went to Solomon Brothers doing management training. And then my last full time job was assistant vice president at Drexel Burnham, where I worked to recruit MBAs from the, for the trading floor, for the institutional sales and trading training program. What I discovered then when we’re talking about passion is I liked the pace.

[00:04:58] Diane DiResta: I liked the money. I liked the work I was doing. I did not like the culture of Wall Street. And that Having worked with people and coached them, I realized the fit is usually about culture, not so much skills mismatch. So I moved on. I started doing freelancing. And decided to go off on my own, little by little, I would pick up different things.

[00:05:17] Diane DiResta: I was like a, uh, an extra pair of hands. And then I said, no, I don’t want to be a freelance. I want to have an expertise. So today my company, Duresta Communications, works with leaders, lawyers, and executives who want to show up powerfully so that they’re confident, clear, and influential. So how does that happen?

[00:05:35] Diane DiResta: Either through keynote speaking, workshops, and seminars, webinars. Executive speech coaching or media training. And then along the way, I wrote a book called knockout presentations. And that is now in its third edition, so I’m very proud of that because it has such a wide breadth. It’s been used as a textbook in some colleges and also has been read in the C suite.

[00:05:57] Diane DiResta: So it’s very practical and it has do’s and don’ts. So if you can’t hire me or you can’t work with a coach, can’t take a paid course, then this is the next best thing to having me there because I wrote it like a seminar

[00:06:10] Steve Fretzin: in a book. Okay. Yeah, that’s nice. I like when books are very tactical and actionable, and it isn’t that it’s necessarily gonna fix all of someone’s problems, but it’s, it’s a step in the right direction.

[00:06:21] Steve Fretzin: That’s how I kind of feel about, about the books I’ve written and the people that the books I’ve read. I don’t know that it, you know, ultimately you take what you can from them. And then was there some be that lawyer tipping point, something that happened in your career that really changed you for the better, for the different?

[00:06:34] Diane DiResta: Well, more recently, one thing that happened was the pandemic. And at the time, not only was there lockdown and things weren’t, you couldn’t go out and do things in person, at the same time, my husband was going for a kidney transplant, and I couldn’t even visit in the hospital, so I really had to be close to home.

[00:06:53] Diane DiResta: I gave up my office because I said, I’m not paying rent, I’m making a donation, I can’t use it. And then, what that turned out to be was a virtual business, so now I’m 99 percent virtual. I came back to a home office, so I have to tell you honestly, Steve, I don’t miss commuting, but I do miss the camaraderie.

[00:07:13] Diane DiResta: So I like it when I do have an opportunity to go in person, but I get to choose those moments. So in a week, I’m going to be talking to a group of realtors in New Jersey in person. I’m looking forward to that. But for the most part, everything I do can be done on zoom.

[00:07:30] Steve Fretzin: Yeah. I love doing zoom presentations.

[00:07:34] Steve Fretzin: It’s been definitely my jam since the pandemic and occasionally I’ll get. An opportunity to speak in person or do a networking event in person. Those are lovely as well. But, you know, again, to, to have to take a day, a half a day or a day to go do something, um, you know, it’s certainly, certainly convenient.

[00:07:51] Steve Fretzin: So let’s talk a little bit about for lawyers, the value of speaking. And there’s a number of lawyers that, that have made that their bread and butter. And I think the pandemic really. Kind of took them back a number of steps and now they’ve either figured out the zoom way to go or they, they’re just now getting back into live presentations, but what’s their value of, of doing, of getting in front of people and sharing knowledge.

[00:08:14] Steve Fretzin: It’s

[00:08:15] Diane DiResta: huge. I, I’ve been saying for years, long before the pandemic. That speaking is one of the most powerful and cost effective marketing tools you can have. Think about the cost of ads, even pay per click and Google search and all of that, and writing, all of that. But when you can show up and speak, it’s really just the cost of your time.

[00:08:38] Diane DiResta: Even if you don’t, first of all, in some places they’ll pay you so you can actually make money doing it. But if you do it well, it’s a marketing tool where if you’re in front of the right people, You are the best advertising. And here’s how I describe speaking to your target market. It’s like test driving a car.

[00:08:57] Diane DiResta: They get to see you in action. And so that no like trust factor accelerates, they get to see you and you don’t know where that seed’s going to germinate. So it’s a mistake to think, okay, we’re gonna give this one speech and then hundreds of people will come up and hire me. No, it doesn’t work that way.

[00:09:14] Diane DiResta: You’re building a database in a relationship, but I will tell you. I got a call years ago from a woman who said, I’d like to work with you. She was a VP in a company in Tennessee. I’m in New York. And then I said, how did you hear of me? And she said, well, about 10 years ago, when I was at a meeting in New York, I attended a women’s group or something, and you were a speaker to this day.

[00:09:35] Diane DiResta: We can’t figure out what that group was, but she remembered. So keep going, be out there because it’s really powerful and it has a life of its own.

[00:09:46] Steve Fretzin: Yeah. And when you think about the people that hire you or the lawyers who are out there making their best effort, but they’re making mistakes, what are the most common mistakes made by lawyers who, you know, number one is if they’re not speaking, that could be a mistake, but then actually, let’s say they get the gag or, or whatever, what are the common mistakes?

[00:10:06] Diane DiResta: Yeah. Well, number one is avoiding speaking. You can’t afford to do that anymore. They always say that speaking is the new competitive advantage. So you’ve got to be seen, you’ve got to be heard. The second thing, so then, uh, one mistake that people make, lawyers especially, is what I call a data dump. Too much information and getting in the weeds.

[00:10:27] Diane DiResta: What that means is it’s overload, information overload. Now, here’s the mistake that’s made. I have all this data, all this information. If I can only open my mind and share it all, you’ll be so much more enriched. No, just the opposite happens. What you do is you overwhelm the audience. So then what happens is you need to do less.

[00:10:48] Diane DiResta: So less is more when it comes to informing. So that’s the first thing. Hey,

[00:10:53] Steve Fretzin: real quick, I just want to mention, I was, I was presenting after someone at an event and I was, I, as he was going on data dump, I mean, exactly what you’re saying and one by one in the room, I saw people pick up their phones. And then when someone saw someone else had their phone, then another person by the time the guy was halfway through, everybody was looking down at their phones.

[00:11:14] Steve Fretzin: Nobody was paying attention. And I was going on next, it was like a comedian with a really bad opener that like kind of ruins the crowd. I had to like totally, totally pick them up. I told them I was going to come around with a sombrero and collect their cell phones before I start, but I don’t think that would have gone over.

[00:11:28] Steve Fretzin: That’s great. Anyway, but yeah, to your point, to your point. Yeah. And in too many words on the screen, like it just needs to be reading from the screen. It’s all the words are on the screen.

[00:11:37] Diane DiResta: Yeah, it’s, uh, the verbosity thing. And, uh, the other mistake I, I thought of three for today’s interview. Number two, I would say speaking too fast.

[00:11:48] Diane DiResta: Now, here’s the deal. I’m not saying that lawyers are speed talkers, but what happens is we don’t put in the pause. So, it’s like one run on sentence. So, if I say, Today is Monday, tomorrow will be Tuesday, and then it will be Wednesday, that’s not too fast, but it doesn’t land because there’s no space in between.

[00:12:08] Diane DiResta: So, knowing how to slow it down. Now, I bring this up because recently I worked with a law firm, And they called me in because these were fast talking New Yorkers trying a case in Texas, and they were getting reamed by the judge, reamed by the court’s doctor to slow down. So, luckily, I have speech analytics and I put them through a program and they got to actually see how many words per minute they spoke.

[00:12:32] Diane DiResta: We slowed them down and then they said, this is too slow. I said, not for Texas. It’s not. That is showing your audience, you got to know your audience able to adapt. That’s a hard one for a lot of people. Yeah. Third mistake, too technical. So this is a little different from too much information. This is where people are getting in the weeds.

[00:12:52] Diane DiResta: I had a CFO once who was referred to me and he was newly promoted. He was ready for the job except for one thing. When he would present to the partners, their eyes were rolling in their heads because he was reading a spreadsheet. And so he had to learn how to speak at a 30, 000 foot level. So again, it comes back to knowing your audience.

[00:13:11] Diane DiResta: How do they like to receive information? Get away from the jargon, the legalese, the acronyms. We don’t understand it. Don’t talk as if you’re reading a contract. Simplify it. One of the things I do with people, because I’m very good at getting right to the kernel of the message, is I help people speak in soundbites.

[00:13:29] Diane DiResta: Say it to me so that I understand. If I understand, it’s clear. So those are some of the key mistakes. That people make, and those are guaranteed to get people looking at their phones.

[00:13:40] Steve Fretzin: Yeah, right on, and that’s, and here’s the other thing with speaking on Zoom too, I have you here, and then I have my screen over here with my email and everything that’s attracting my attention.

[00:13:51] Steve Fretzin: My phone is over here, you’re in the middle, and if you’re not keeping me engaged, I’ve got easy access on a zoom to not, you’re not going to know that I’m less, of course you’re seeing me, but even then I see people in networking meetings all the time that are drifting away. And I kind of look around the room and see everybody’s

[00:14:08] Diane DiResta: drifting.

[00:14:08] Diane DiResta: So I would say the two mistakes, if I keep it simple on virtual presentation would be sticking and engagement. So first staging notice, I have this kind of background, so have the right background, but the number one is eye contact. Right now, I am looking at a lens, so I tell people that you have to imagine you’re doing a broadcast, a satellite broadcast, you are a broadcaster now.

[00:14:32] Diane DiResta: So what I do, Steve, is when you’re talking, I’ll look at your face, so I get the non verbals, but when I’m speaking like now, I look directly in the lens, so I have an eye connection. So that’s the first thing, staging. And the second mistake is engagement. As you said, if you don’t have things going on, A poll, or questions, or a pause, or something, an interesting content, you’re losing them.

[00:14:54] Diane DiResta: Yeah. They’re on their phones.

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[00:16:43] Steve Fretzin: Yeah, I mean, I teach a 90 minute. Class on business development, every Tuesday morning, I’ve got clients from all over the country that come in and they work with me one on one, but they get this class as a part of it. And for me to keep them engaged for 90 minutes, I think 45 minutes is like the limit that most people can handle, but I’ve got them for 90 minutes.

[00:17:01] Steve Fretzin: And they know, and this is like the second grade teacher stuff, but like that, I’m going to call on them at any point. Like, I’m going to say, John, what do you think of this? You know, Jonathan, what do you think of this? And what’s your thought? Like they know, like I’m on top of it all the time. So they have to really pay attention because they don’t want to be the one in the group that goes, sorry, I was totally not paying attention.

[00:17:20] Steve Fretzin: I mean, that happens on occasion and they’re embarrassed, but mostly they’re, no, they’re, and then you’re putting them into, into, you know, groups to role play and breaking things up, having multiple different subjects and topics. But I think, I think it’s really important, yeah. But people that are doing a zoom, uh, presentations, uh, need to consider how they would be in a zoom, attending a zoom and they need to realize, but to put yourself in those shoes, if you’re not engaging people, you’re in trouble.

[00:17:47] Steve Fretzin: They’re going to be drifting fast.

[00:17:49] Diane DiResta: Absolutely. Absolutely. And so you need to pre plan that and the more people can engage the better. So, I’ve actually done presentation skills. On zoom, of course, and one of the things we do with staging is all right, let’s hear the tips, the techniques now in the gallery.

[00:18:06] Diane DiResta: You’re each going to be a coach. So Steve, look at Diane and give her feedback on how she staged and it’s amazing how engaging that is rather than for me to just talk. Don’t be a talking head. That’s the big mistake in virtual presentations.

[00:18:20] Steve Fretzin: Yeah. Don’t be a talking head. I love that. So there’s also, I don’t know if it’s an, it’s an antiquated statistic that, you know, fear of public speaking is the number one fear.

[00:18:32] Steve Fretzin: I, I looked it up prior to our talk today and saw that it’s now number four and there’s other things that have come up, you know, fear of rejection being, being ahead of that, but it’s still at the tie in the top five. I mean, that, that, so how do introverts and people that are uncomfortable, uh, doing presentations, how do they get around that?

[00:18:49] Steve Fretzin: What are you teaching them?

[00:18:50] Diane DiResta: Okay, well, first of all, I love that because 1977 Book of Lists was, Spear of Speaking is number one. So if it’s down to four, maybe Toastmasters and all of us as speech coaches are having an impact. So what do you do when you’re nervous? Well, here’s what I tell everybody, whether you’re extroverted or introverted.

[00:19:08] Diane DiResta: If you are really nervous, you’re being self centered because you’re thinking about me, myself, and I. Oh, what if I trip? What if I have brain fog? Get over yourself. It’s not about you. It’s about them, the audience. Your focus is in the wrong place. So I know that if you’re nervous, You’re in the future.

[00:19:29] Diane DiResta: You’re imagining everything that can go wrong. So, you need to come back to present moment, so you can be present with the audience, and you do that through the breath. So, a couple of things. The first is preparation. There’s no substitute, and it’s 90 percent preparation and 10 percent delivery. So, when someone says, you want how much for an hour?

[00:19:48] Diane DiResta: Well, it’s not an hour. It’s days, it’s months, all that prep. Prepare. Secondly, Get focused on the breath. So there


[00:19:57] Diane DiResta: different breathing techniques we can use. Sometimes they teach the square breathing, which is count of four. Inhale, hold, exhale, hold again. And so what that does is it slows down the physiology and the fast speeding heart.

[00:20:13] Diane DiResta: And another technique for managing nerves is, well I mentioned already practicing, but actually practicing the pause. Because when you pause, it gives you time to think, the message lands. And here’s a tip Steve, always memorize your opening line. This is where people stumble the most, they don’t know how to get started.

[00:20:35] Diane DiResta: So memorize your opening line, and then ground yourself. If it’s a virtual presentation, I teach a grounding position where you lean in at a 45 degree angle. If you are standing, then it’s how you ground your stance and, and your posture. But all of that are, all of that is, are ways to manage your nervousness.

[00:20:56] Diane DiResta: I actually have a chapter, I think it’s chapter 3, called Fear Fixes in Knockout Presentations and has all of these techniques. There’s so many out there.

[00:21:07] Steve Fretzin: I mean, one that I think has worked for me and I’ve been, you know, speaking for over 20 years publicly and in front of groups of thousands and groups of 10 has been knowing your subject matter better than anybody.

[00:21:18] Steve Fretzin: Because if I, I did a presentation yesterday for the Chicago Bar Association, I had nothing planned. It was literally a whiteboard. What are your toughest challenges in business development? And off the cuff, I was able to present on every challenge and work solving those and trying to get interaction. It was, it was no sweat because I know my subject so well.

[00:21:39] Steve Fretzin: So I think, you know, people that are speaking on a subject, that’s maybe a newer subject, really, you know, engulf yourself in it so that you know it better than anybody. And then when it comes to speaking about it, it’s just, it’s coming out more naturally too.

[00:21:51] Diane DiResta: And on that vein or in that vein, people came to hear your information.

[00:21:57] Diane DiResta: So it’s not about you. So think about that. They want what you have. They’re not trying to. Denigrate you in any way. They’re on your side. They want your information, so give it to them. That’s why they’re there. And you’re right. I always say, don’t, don’t memorize familiarize. So have key points like you did on the board instead of scripting your message.

[00:22:20] Diane DiResta: Because if you forget a word, I can’t help you. Right. But you can always say it a different way if you know your key messages, and I tell people about rule of three. Group things in three because it’s memorable. Three main points, three benefits, three agenda items. People will remember

[00:22:38] Steve Fretzin: threes. And so I do, you know, be that lawyer, confident, organized, skilled rainmaker.

[00:22:42] Steve Fretzin: And then you did yours and you had three, right? The three, three key words that you want, you know,

[00:22:47] Diane DiResta: confident, clear and influential. Yes, absolutely. All right.

[00:22:50] Steve Fretzin: And so that’s how we, how we pull it together. So let’s, let’s wrap up with a final couple points on how speaking Zoom or in person helps lawyers to really market themselves, brand themselves.

[00:23:05] Steve Fretzin: It actually impacts business development in a, in many ways. What are your thoughts? What are your kind of, what have you seen? And what are the, what are the upsides of that?

[00:23:13] Diane DiResta: Well, the upside, as I mentioned, people get to see you in action. So whether you’re on a… A virtual screen or in person, they get to see your personality.

[00:23:22] Diane DiResta: They get to hear your story. So one of the things that you want to do is tell stories because stories touch the heart. They’re memorable and they are self disclosing. People want to know who you are. So you want to be authentic and you want to do you. Don’t mimic somebody else. Yes, you can borrow techniques, but just be you because there’s only one you.

[00:23:42] Diane DiResta: You’re unique. Tell your story. And those are the things that people remember. We were having a conversation earlier about a baseball player, and I said what I remembered was his story as a kid. So those are really key. Also keep in mind what’s important to the audience. Too many presentations are speaker centered instead of listener centered.

[00:24:02] Diane DiResta: And so I show people a strategy or a format of listener centered communication. Start with what’s important to them, not, Good afternoon, today I’m going to talk to you about, you know, so what.


[00:24:14] Diane DiResta: what, as you said, what are their challenges? So imagine you already know their challenges or some of them, and you begin with that and start with a hook.

[00:24:22] Diane DiResta: What’s something that they really want? You know, everybody here wants to build their book of business. Wouldn’t it be great if there was a simple way, a single point of focus to get more business coming? Okay. I’ve got your attention. Well, what’s the problem? Well, people are avoiding this powerful skill, which is called public speaking and a great marketing tool.

[00:24:41] Diane DiResta: And once you know the school, the skills, you’ll gain the confidence. I’m going to show you how to do that today. Do you think people would listen instead of good afternoon? We’re going to talk about speaking as a marketing tool. Yeah. Very

[00:24:53] Steve Fretzin: different. And I think that the other thing that people forget is that a lot of the content that you create for presentations can be repurposed that there could be video clips that you create.

[00:25:04] Steve Fretzin: There could be articles that can be created around your, around your topic that could be, you know, given to, you know, publications or put on your blog. There’s social media posts around it. You can promote yourself that you’re speaking at a certain place like. There’s, there’s more to it than just showing up and doing the presentation and then hoping that you’re going to get someone walking up and saying, I need to hire you, you know, for a litigation matter.

[00:25:27] Steve Fretzin: Um, there’s a lot more movement that you, but you need to create that and know that there’s more, more to it than just showing up.

[00:25:34] Diane DiResta: Yeah. There’s the before, during and after. So even if you can send an email or even a quick video clip, hi, I’m looking forward to speaking. Here’s what we’re going to talk about.

[00:25:44] Diane DiResta: Then you give the actual presentation, and then, you Follow up with leads, information. It’s very important to make some kind of free offer for people. And a lot of times people forget the call to action and that’s critical. Even in your, your social media posts, what’s the call to action? What do you want them to do next?

[00:26:04] Diane DiResta: Are you going to send them to a YouTube channel, whatever. And that’s another good idea. I don’t know if legally every law firm has that ability. But if you can post videos someplace, maybe it’s in the firm or on a YouTube channel, that’s great because they can keep having an experience of you. So stay in touch.

[00:26:24] Diane DiResta: Stay

[00:26:24] Steve Fretzin: in touch. And the other thing I feel like happens to lawyers a lot is they, they do all this preparation, they show up and do it, it happens, and then it’s over. And that’s the end of it, and they move on to the next thing. Meanwhile, they put in, you know, 10, 20, 30 hours into something. Now, like, to your point, 10 years later, someone might call, or a year later, someone might call, or someone might actually walk up to them at the end and say, I have a litigation matter.

[00:26:50] Steve Fretzin: But is there a way that you recommend people to have better follow up, to have a better next step, a third chapter of that story, if you will?

[00:26:59] Diane DiResta: Yeah, it’s the difference between being strategic and tactical. So the tactical is I show up, I do it, and get some cards and hope something hits. Being strategic is having that long game.

[00:27:10] Diane DiResta: And one of the tools I like to use… Is called talk a dot. It’s a way to get people in the room giving you feedback instantly with the QR code. You hold up your phone and has a few questions and then you’re making an offer. I’ll give you a PDF of the slides or whatever that offer is. And so you capture them in the moment when they are excited.

[00:27:31] Diane DiResta: Another thing you can do is capture testimonials on a phone in the moment when they’re excited. So you have those and they’re on on your site or wherever it is. And then have other tools for follow up. In other words, how many touch points do you want? Are you going to be in touch once a month, once a week?

[00:27:51] Diane DiResta: Daily is too much. I delete anybody who sends me daily emails. But stay on their radar because people forget. They’re excited in the moment and then they forget about you. So, those are some of the things. Have those touch points prepared. It could be an email. It could be a quick video. It could be… Let’s, let’s schedule a coffee, let’s schedule a zoom for those A leads.

[00:28:16] Diane DiResta: Yeah,

[00:28:16] Steve Fretzin: really good. So we’ve kind of covered a lot of ground from the challenges to the solutions and, and marketing and everything. Let’s, uh, let’s wrap things up with your game changing podcast called, uh, Gladden, the Gladden Longevity Podcast. I don’t think I’ve heard that before.

[00:28:31] Diane DiResta: Yeah. Yeah. I’m very focused on health these days.

[00:28:33] Diane DiResta: Okay. So I listened to a lot of different podcasts, but I tend to listen to that one because it’s all cutting edge health technologies. So whether it’s stem cells or, you know, some computer or some kind of diet, I love listening to the, the entrepreneurs who have these products and programs that are. New and different and making great results.

[00:29:02] Diane DiResta: So I usually listen to that on the treadmill because I don’t like doing the treadmill. I’m not a hamster.

[00:29:07] Steve Fretzin: You got to ease your pain, ease your pain.

[00:29:09] Diane DiResta: Yeah. So that’s how I do it. Glad that’s my favorite. Glad, glad and longevity. Yeah.

[00:29:14] Steve Fretzin: Check that out, everybody. And as we wrap up, I want to thank our sponsors. Of course, get staffed up, helping people get full time marketing and administrative, uh, folks that to back and back up and support them.

[00:29:26] Steve Fretzin: We’ve got get visible on the marketing side. And Lawmatics helping you really keep track of your people. And again, great follow up systems and great automations with Lawmatics. Diane, if people want to get in touch with you, they want to buy your book. They want to, you know, you know, work with you to improve, uh, how they speak and getting more gigs and things like that.

[00:29:46] Steve Fretzin: What, what’s the best way for them to reach you?

[00:29:48] Diane DiResta: Through my website, duresta. com, D as in David, I, R, E, S as in Sam, T as in Thomas, A, duresta. com. And the book can be found online or in Barnes Noble. Knockout Presentations.

[00:30:01] Steve Fretzin: Knockout Presentations. And we’ll, we’ll keep all that in the show notes too for everybody.

[00:30:04] Steve Fretzin: You can scroll down on your phone and find that stuff. Well, thank you so much. I mean, this is, this has been wonderful and it’s a topic that doesn’t get talked about enough and I think it’s, it’s not a dying art. It’s, it’s a, it’s re it’s got, it’s rejuvenated and I think people need to get back out there that, that maybe we’re doing it before the pandemic and now need to get reinvigorated to get, to get out and, and get in front of people because there is so much business to be done and so much brand to be built with this, with these particular skills.

[00:30:31] Steve Fretzin: So, um, thank you so much.

[00:30:33] Diane DiResta: Thank you for

[00:30:34] Steve Fretzin: having me. Yeah, yeah. And thank you everybody for spending time with Diane and I today on the Be That Lawyer podcast. I know it’s, it’s hard to, you know, do the marketing and the business development when you have the billable hour. And you have family and you’ve got young kids or whatever your situation is.

[00:30:49] Steve Fretzin: However, I think what you’ll find is that, um, having your own book of business and focusing on building your brand is going to be critical to your future. And the lawyers that are really focused on that is they’re going to be ahead in five, 10 years. And the ones that aren’t are going to be playing catch up.

[00:31:05] Steve Fretzin: So really take it to heart and keep, keep listening to the show. We love having you. And don’t be shy about telling your friends about the, be that lawyer podcast and giving us a five star rating, a thumbs up, whatever it is that you’ve got in front of you. Thank you. And again, well, we’re here every week, twice a week to help you be that lawyer.

[00:31:20] Steve Fretzin: Someone who’s confident, organized, and a skilled rate maker. Take care, everybody. Be safe. Be well. We will talk again soon.

[00:31:29] Narrator: Thanks for listening to Be That Lawyer. Life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Visit Steve’s website Fretzin. com for additional information and to stay up to date on the latest legal business development and marketing trends. For more information and important links about today’s episode, visit Check out today’s show notes.