Jennifer Bullock: Creating Your Own Harmonizing Book of Business

In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Jennifer Bullock discuss:

  • Treating customers in a way that will make them feel like your only customer.
  • Becoming a strong, influential woman in law.
  • The importance of committing to your business growth and development early on as part of your necessary work.
  • Harmonizing your work and your life in the right environment.

Key Takeaways:

  • When you are opening your own firm (or even just looking to grow your book of business) talk to everyone you know and make yourself known.
  • Seek out a mentor and build relationships early on. They will require you taking action and will not just fall in your lap.
  • You only need to do two things when you start to work with networking organizations: show up and do what you say you will do.
  • You can build your book of business in non-traditional ways. Look at what you like to do, where you like to be, and who you like to connect with.

“I firmly believe that if you focus on business development, as a female attorney early on in your career, you truly can create your own path, you are in control of your own destiny. You may choose to stay in a firm, you may choose to launch your own firm, you may go in house, but you will have many more opportunities available to you.” —  Jennifer Bullock

Connect with Jennifer Bullock:  





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Book: The Ambitious Attorney: Your Guide to Doubling or Even Tripling Your Book of Business and more!

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Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911

Show notes by Podcastologist Chelsea Taylor-Sturkie

Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You’re the expert. Your podcast will prove it.



client, lawyer, firm, business, women, people, legalese, steve, female, development, calls, attorney, law, practice, outdoors, feel, relationships, coaches, early, steakhouse


Jennifer Bullock, Narrator, Steve Fretzin, Jordan Ostroff


Jennifer Bullock  [00:00]

It’s really about understanding that you have a life that involves all of these complicated aspects. And you have to be able to harmonize all of that in a very supportive environment. So finding the right environment is key.


Narrator  [00:16]

You’re listening to be that lawyer, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Each episode, your host, author and lawyer coach, Steve Fretzin, will take a deeper dive, helping you grow your law practice in less time with greater results. Now, here’s your host, Steve Fretzin.


Steve Fretzin  [00:39]

Hey, everybody, welcome to be that lawyer. I am Steve Fretzin, as the announcer mentioned, and this is my announcer voice in case you hadn’t heard it before, hey, this show is all about helping you to be that lawyer, someone who’s competent organized a skilled Rainmaker. Hopefully you’re paying attention, you’re taking notes, you’re getting some tips and tricks from every single episode. That’s really what this is about. It’s not about the 20,000 foot view of, oh, here’s the overall strategy you should have as a lawyer on business development. It’s the little things, it’s the little ideas, the processes, the language, the tactics, the actions. That’s what really, you know, is what this show is all about. And today is no different. I’ve got an amazing friend, a former client, and someone just terrific. Jennifer Bullock is going to be talking to you in a second. First, I want to thank our sponsors. And we’ve got two amazing sponsors Moneypenny who does Virtual Phone office reception and they do live chat on the website, they’re on my website. So if you want to have a conversation with me, and Moneypenny, you know, go on my website, click on the chat, start having a conversation. And it’ll come around and get to me if there’s a question they can’t answer, I will take care of it. But they’re, they’re positioned to do it. And then also legalese marketing, who handles a lot of my marketing, and they work specifically with lawyers who are looking to outsource all the stuff you shouldn’t be doing. You know how to code a website? Probably not. They do. Do you know how to set up a video crew to come out and take videos, if your lawyers talking about how great your firm is? Probably not. They do. So think about legalese, and how they’re going to help you. So that is that and let’s move on to the quote of the day. And this is a quote that Jennifer gave me and I think it’s absolutely terrific. And this is by Maya Angelou, it’s people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did. But people will never forget how you made them feel. And so that is a terrific quote. And I, I think I, I live that every day, I can say and do a lot of things. But it’s it’s how my clients feel how you feel listening to this podcast. Hopefully you feel like you’re a part of the team. And I think that’s what people remember. So Jennifer, welcome to the show and help us. What’s that quote, mean to you? You shared it with me.


Jennifer Bullock  [02:49]

Thank you so much for having me, Steve, I really appreciate it. It’s great to be here. Yeah, the quote really resonates with me. They part of the model of my firm is about client experience. So obviously, providing exceptional quality work is key for my firm, but providing a quality and exceptional client experience is just as important. And I think that quote says it all it really speaks for itself. How do you make your clients feel at the end of the day? Do they feel like your most important client today feel like your only client, they don’t need to know what else you have going on that you were up all night, preparing for another hearing for a client, they need to know that you are, you know, they are the most important client in your world. And my goal is always to make my clients feel that they are the most important client in my world. So a big focus of my firm is really on the client experience. And there’s a lot of touch points along the way from the very beginning, you know, the very first contact you have with a prospective client to the end of the relationship and continuing to stay in touch with clients that makes that really part of the whole client experience from beginning to end.


Steve Fretzin  [04:00]

Yeah, and I think the statistics say it’s like six to six to 10 times more effort, money time to get a new client than to keep an existing client. So this all goes in line with the client experience and how they feel about you that they’re not just going to jump ship because your rates are high or jump ship because they found another lawyer up the street, you want them sticky, you want them to never leave because of the way they feel the way they’ve been treated and what you’re doing for them maybe even beyond and above the law, right?


Jennifer Bullock  [04:28]

Oh, absolutely. And one of the biggest complaints that clients have about lawyers is they’re not responsive enough. You know, I have I have a lawyer, but it takes the lawyer three days to get back to me or I emailed them and I never heard back and I had to continue to follow up. How does that make the client feel certainly doesn’t make the client feel important. It doesn’t make them feel good about the relationship. So even if you’re getting great results for your client, if you’re not communicating regularly, if you’re not getting back to them quickly. That’s going to affect the client experience and how they they feel about you as their lawyer, whether they’re gonna look to hire you again for the next matter.


Steve Fretzin  [05:04]

Yeah. And hey, everybody, you’re listening to Jennifer Bullock. She’s the founder of Bullock legal and just a terrific, terrific person, can you give us a little bit of a background on your law practice and then and then moving out on your own, which I know is that was kind of a big bold move. So take us back. Sure. So


Jennifer Bullock  [05:22]

I started my career in big law, spent a few years there, then I spent 11 years at a Florida so I’m based in Florida, 11 years at a Florida firm. And then I was recruited to go back to big law, the same big law firm, I think I’m the only one I know, that went to big law twice, same firm, and I spent another few years there, exclusively in the area of labor and employment. That’s all I’ve ever done. For my entire career. Then I was at the last minute, at big law, I was had a great opportunity to work for a nonprofit. So I left the firm I was at, even though it was a it was it was a great firm and I had a great experience with with fantastic clients, it was really a unique opportunity to work at a nonprofit and do something I was passionate about in the community. So I did that for a while. Ultimately, I realized it was not the best fit for me long term, I miss practicing law. And at that point, the vision of block legal was created and I decided to launch my own firm. When I did that. I actually had no clients at the time, although I had been practicing, you know, 16 1516 years and had built great relationships over the years and had good clients. In all those years at firms. I had transitioned all my clients to other attorneys when I left the last firm, because I went to work at a nonprofit, and I wouldn’t be practicing law. So when I decided to to launch my own firm, I was really starting over in a sense, because I didn’t walk into the firm with any clients. And I had to start from from scratch really hustling, making a list of every literally every person that I knew that that could potentially be a good contact for business, letting them know what I was doing what you know, what I’d be offering, and asking them to keep me in mind if they knew anybody was looking for an employment lawyer. And I like to tell the story because you know really think inspires people realize that you can you know, you can do anything you want to do everything is possible. I’ve been in business now, this is my second year. And at a very successful first year in practice on my own starting with no clients, just going back to the drawing board and building off of all those relationships that I had developed over the years. And my first two clients, as I started block legal were owners of the salons that I went to, because as I mentioned, I literally spoke to every person that I knew. And everywhere I went, whether it’s a doctor’s office, the salon, anywhere I let them know what I was doing, and who you know, reminded them who I was, what my experience was. And those were the two the first two business owners that hire me


Steve Fretzin  [08:01]

in a conversation that we’ve had half a dozen times, if not more, has been about women in law and how few rainmakers there are in comparison to the men and why that is and why it shouldn’t be that way. And can you talk to that a little bit because obviously, you’re someone that has taken it upon herself to be a rainmaker and to build your own firm. And I think that’s not only inspiring, but also you’ve got some strong opinions about about women in law and what they should be doing.


Jennifer Bullock  [08:31]

Absolutely. As a profession, I don’t think we do a good enough job of creating environments that take into account some of the unique challenges that women lawyers space. And I don’t think we do a good enough job of providing female role models in senior leadership in most firms. You know, I can tell you that I’ve had great mentors in my career at the law firms that I worked at, and they were all men. And they were fantastic. But I didn’t have female role models. And at the firms that I worked at there was I can really only think of one female partner who was a rainmaker. Just one. And so as a young lawyer, sort of growing up in these firms, it felt almost unattainable like I was, you know, quite you know, it was an uphill battle, the odds are against you, how am I going to raise a family and develop a look at business? Is this even possible. And so you have sort of that those, those things going through your head at the same time, you’re trying to just do the best possible work, you can learn as much as you can. And then you know, in your personal life, possibly, you know, looking to grow, you know, have a family and return to work and manage all of that at the same time. So, you know, I think it’s important to take ownership of that early on in your career as a female lawyer because it really is attainable. But I think there are certain things you you should focus on early on to make sure to set yourself up, you know, to be successful,


Steve Fretzin  [09:54]

as what does that look like? Just so you can, you know, give them give a little more, a little more meat on the bone


Jennifer Bullock  [10:00]

Well, first, I think it’s important that you look for a mentor early on, and that mentor might be and perhaps should be outside of your law firm. You know, I mentor female attorneys, because I want to be that person that a young attorney can look up to and say, she did it, it can be done, I have three kids, you know, I went work to big law, I successfully opened my own firm. And so if I can be that role model for younger female attorneys, I want to I want to do that. So I think it’s important to have a mentor, and to seek that out, because most likely, it’s not, it’s not going to come to you, then I would say focus on building relationships early on. So when you’re starting out, you’re young lawyer, it’s overwhelming. Yeah, more work than you feel like you can handle there’s not enough hours in the day, the idea of business development, it just probably doesn’t even cross your mind. But if you don’t start thinking about it early on in your career, you’re gonna get to a point. And oh, Steve, we’ve talked about this many times, five or six years in, you’re at a firm, you’re starting to think about partnership, and somebody comes up to you and says, What’s your book of business, and you realize, I don’t have any, or, you know, I’m not there yet. And it’s really hard at that point to get started. And there are so many things you can do early on smaller things to ease into it just to set the foundation for later on developing business. And, and the biggest thing that you can do early on is just start developing those relationships, get out there and meet people. Keep in touch with people find out what you know, interests, different people. And that could be within the legal profession, outside of the legal profession, the business community, whether it’s, you know, nonprofit world, there’s so many ways to meet people, but just go out there and you know, make yourself known and meet people and keep in touch with them, they will remember you. And then one other important thing I think you can do early on when you’re ready is to get involved in intergroup can be any type of group that you could be on a board of a nonprofit, you could be in the you know, the Bar Association, local bar association, the Rotary Club, whatever it may be, I say, don’t overcommit. Sometimes we tend to do that. But pick one, pick one and do two things. These are the two things number one, show up. Number two, do what you say you’re gonna do. If you just do those two things, and nothing else, you’re ahead of the game, because you’d be amazed at how many people fail at number one, they don’t show up regularly. But if you’re the person that shows up, every time there’s a meeting, you will be remembered. And then over time, when you get when you feel more comfortable, you will be the one that’s offered or given the opportunity to take a leadership position. And then you’ll really be able to get noticed, you know, for what you’re capable of doing.


Steve Fretzin  [12:51]

And it’s funny, I was having a conversation with another lawyer client of mine who was trying to differentiate himself amongst a lot of other lawyers in a networking group. And I just said, you’re already doing it, I said, Be the best giver, you can be the person that’s thanked the most in the test. And we always like talk about like, who gave testimonials and who gave the most connections. And this guy does it all the time. So just keep doing that. Because your name is mentioned three, four, or five times in a meeting the other personal injury attorneys aren’t. And even if they’re have similar areas of focus than you do, you’re the name that people are going to remember. And you’re the one they’re going to want to get together with. So I think be a giver, right? And help others selflessly, intelligently, don’t you can’t help everybody with everything, but do your best to then follow through to your point, Jennifer, like, if you’re saying if you’re gonna do something, you better do it. Like people commitments need to be kept. And when they’re failed on build upon, that’s when people start to lose trust. And if you lose trust with a person or a community, it’s over. You’re not gonna you’re not gonna be where you want to be at all.


Jennifer Bullock  [13:54]

Absolutely, I think I think that’s where women may have an edge. You know, as, as women, we tend to be natural givers, natural connectors of people. And so in terms of laying the foundation for being a good business developer, I think, you know, potentially women have, you know, can have an edge or can, you know, have those natural abilities to be really good at it, you know, we’re often natural nurturers, and that makes connecting with others easy. And since relationship, we know relationships are the key to good business development, it’s it’s something you can do really early on in your career without too much of a commitment.


Steve Fretzin  [14:30]

Yeah, and what are what are some other because we could talk about some potential disadvantages that women have in business development and growing a book, but what are what are a couple other advantages that you found for yourself and that you’ve seen with others, obviously, being nurturing being a giver, top of the list, what would be what would be one or two others that come to mind?


Jennifer Bullock  [14:49]

I think one other one other thing would be that women enjoy connecting with other women. Oftentimes, you know, we identify with some of the unique challenges faced by other women I think women like to uplift and support other women. I know I’ve I’ve received tremendous support from other female business owners who like to say, you know, it’s really great to see other women out there doing great things with their business. So I think that, you know, that’s that’s a big part of it, too.


Jordan Ostroff  [15:17]

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Steve Fretzin  [16:05]

I mean, I’ve even seen, you know, a number of men and men even in power positions, that just they love, that there are women stepping up wanting to make it rain, that there are women stepping up, that are trying to develop practice areas and be leaders and I in we’re just aching to like, let them run with something, you know, that they’re that they’re passionate about. And I think that that whole dei diversity, equity inclusion, and everything that’s been coming up to the surface in the last five or 10 years is all leading to, you know, women leading and women taking charge, and really stepping up the three white guys running the firm that’s dying out. I mean, that’s that sort of real old school mentality. And so I think there’s, there’s a shift happening. And we need to lean into that shift as a part of what the future of law is going to look like.


Jennifer Bullock  [16:53]

Absolutely. Remember, clients are women too. And clients want to hire and support women, they look at firms, and they look at the senior leadership of firms, and they want to see women there. And that is really important. So firms recognize that they need to do it because clients are asking, and clients are noticing, not just because it’s the right thing to do. But we know the profession has a challenging time keeping women, you know, long term, and we need to be able to face those challenges head on. And I think a big piece of that really is business development, I firmly believe that if you focus on business development, as a female attorney early on in your career, you truly can create your own path, you are in control of your own destiny, you may choose to stay in a firm, you may choose to launch your own firm, you may go in house, but you will have many more opportunities available to you. If you focus on the business development early on and do what you can to have your own relationships. And I just think that the more we can amplify that message, Steve, you know, I think the more you female lawyers, we can help as they grow in their careers.


Steve Fretzin  [18:05]

And you know, it’s interesting, because you and I have had this conversation, you were in a class not so long ago, mainly with men. And you and I had a couple of conversations, like what is going on here? Why is it that you know, in a class of 10, I’m the only, you know, the female or or one of two females. And I scratched my head. And I said, I don’t know why I wish I did. And we’ve kind of been going back and forth about it. But I don’t know if women are more interested in getting coached and trained by other women, or if they feel that that everything I say is just mansplaining. And I just, I scratch my head because I feel like the good business development, coaching and training. It shouldn’t be, you know, based on someone’s sex, it should be based on their experience and knowledge and expertise, and how, again, they they they help you accomplish goals. So I don’t know if that’s something you can add a little a little extra to, but no, absolutely.


Jennifer Bullock  [18:54]

You know, we talk about this all the time, Steve. And I remember coming to you and saying how can we get more women into your program? Because we need that you need that within your group of clients. To have that diversity and perspective. You need to have different perspectives people have had different experiences having female lawyers in the group is is critical. How can we reach more women and help them understand the importance of business development? I think one of the big challenges that women lawyers face is time, you know, we’re all pressed for time. We never have enough time to do the things we need to do. We’ve got our work commitments, our deadlines, our personal family commitments, how do we manage to do it all and then you add business development in? So I think some of it is a mindset, understanding early on in your career, that this is part of the work aspect. This is just as critical is getting your client work done. You know, spending 30 minutes a day, an hour to a week, whatever it may be, but committing to it early on, and making this a part of you know, Your growth and development as an attorney, it’s really a commitment to yourself. So I think part of it is the mindset, it’s understanding. It’s not, you know, this is going to take away from my personal time at home, if I only have an extra hour a day and unused, you know, I’m spending that at home with my kids. How am I going to now go to a networking event? How can I justify going to a networking event being away from home, I think this, this came up during your podcast with Leslie Cohen. And I think she addressed it. It was fantastic how she addressed it, there’s so many different ways to develop business and to network and meet people. And it used to be, you’d have to be on the golf course, hobnobbing, you’d have to go to evening, you know, networking events, and charity events and breakfast meetings, and it looks so different. Now, you don’t have to do those things, you absolutely don’t, you don’t have to choose between spending time with your family. And going to a networking event that that was the case back in the day, even when I started practicing, I took golf lessons, I bought golf clubs, and I was on the golf course, because that’s where business was happening. And I didn’t want to miss out. But that is not the case anymore. There are other ways to develop relationships to meet people to mix what you’re passionate about in your personal life, with business development. So you’re kind of doing both things. At the same time, if what you’re passionate about is giving back to the community, join an organization or get involved in organization, you can volunteer and bring your kids and get to know the people at the organization and meet people that way, there’s so many different ways of doing doing it. And just starting out by building those relationships, if you look at it that way, and not in the traditional way of I won’t be at home for dinner, or I won’t be you know, it’ll take time away from my family, because I have to go to a networking event at this time in the evening, when it would normally be family time. And just look at it a little bit differently there, there is a solution to every problem, right, it’s just a matter of finding a different way of looking at it.


Steve Fretzin  [21:53]

Well, and one of the things I’ve been pitching for a long time is you know, when you have your own clients, you’re in control you you can decide what work you’re going to do what work you’re going to hand off to associates what work you’re going to take on or not take on, when you’re not when you don’t have your own clients, then, you know, it’s it’s you’ve got five bosses, and they’re all telling you what work to work on. And so you’re you’re in a different position to, you know, have the balance or create the balance that you’re looking for. And it’s just one, you know, one of a number of ways. But obviously, that’s, you know, that’s one of a really good way to do it, especially if you’re looking to scale within a firm or on your own. So I think that’s that’s one thing. And then is there another I mean, you mentioned three kids, you mentioned, you know, your own practice, you know, you’ve got to know full stable clients and all that. So what how do you keep the balance.


Jennifer Bullock  [22:44]

So it’s interesting because and I really like to, there’s, there’s somebody that said this best, it’s Jamie McKeon who is chair of Morgan Lewis, she’s actually the first female Chair of the firm, which was a really big deal. And she talks about work life balance all the time. And she says, she doesn’t like the term work life balance, because it’s as if you have two different lives, you know, a work life and personal life. And that’s just not the way it is you have, you have a life in which sometimes work takes over, for example, you’re preparing for trial, or sometimes your personal life takes over, like you have a child or you have a personal emergency. And it’s about recognizing the fact that you have a life that involves, you know, both aspects and finding a way to harmonize. I think at the end of the day, the harmonizing part can only happen when you have a work environment that supports who you are, as a person, a work environment that recognizes and appreciates the fact that you have a great work, work ethic, and you’re willing to work hard. But you’re also a working mom of three kids that you have a passion for running marathons, that when you like to take time off, you want to be able to disconnect and travel to a far off place, or whatever that might be. But if you don’t have that kind of work environment, it will be very, very difficult to harmonize. And so I believe that that really is key. It’s not you know, I spent three hours a day on this, and I spent three hours a day that we can’t look at our we can’t carve up our day like that, I think I think then you will find it’s too challenging. It’s really about understanding that you have a life that involves all of these complicated aspects. And you have to be able to harmonize all of that in a very supportive environment. So finding the right environment is key.


Steve Fretzin  [24:25]

And I think there’s definitely an evolution that a lawyer goes through as it relates to you know, associate to partner partner to equity, maybe it’s someone running his or her own her own firm and I also work with a lot of managing partners, and they feel or they you know, one of their challenges will everybody wants to work with me if I’m not involved with this or that and the other reality is that there’s some things Yeah, you probably need to be involved in but a lot of it can be delegated a lot of the communication, a lot of the work a lot of the interaction that you think only you can do, realistically it can be pushed out It’s a lot of times about how we set expectations with clients, and how we set the table so that we can we can get away and not feel like you know, we, if we take a vacation, the whole world is going to end right


Jennifer Bullock  [25:11]

away. I agree. And I think especially when you’re when you’re the owner of a small firm, you focus on Systemising, as much as you can, practicing efficiently, I have a flat fee firm. So my model is all about practicing efficiently. The better your systems are, the more time you have to actually focus on the practice of law and the things that you as an attorney need to be doing, as opposed to things that you can be delegating to somebody who’s not an attorney. So you can bring your own time up to be doing the things that that must be done by you or can only be done by you.


Steve Fretzin  [25:45]

Well, listen, everything that’s been spoken about between us in the last 30 minutes, I think, has been really, really important and impactful to not only lawyers, but women lawyers, who are maybe having some anxiety or some angst about about where they can go in their career. And I just want to let you know, you know, it’s all out there. And Jennifer’s just a great another great example of what can happen when you put your mind to something you systems, you hire coaches and mentors, you don’t try to do it all on your own. There’s just there’s a lot of different ways to go in and it’s all out there and available. You just have to look for it and want it. I think it’s a part of it has to do with ambition and interest, right?


Jennifer Bullock  [26:23]

Oh, absolutely. Opportunities. I believe the opportunities are really unlimited. It’s whatever you want, want it to be, you just have to go out there and get it. Yes, you have to work hard. But if you you know, there are great resources, great mentors, great coaches out there, you don’t have to do it alone. You don’t have to do the trial and error thing you can go to people who have spent like, you know, you Steve years and years honing your craft, and have, you know, great, great, you know, structured program and guidance for lawyers specifically to be successful rainmakers, you know, why go and do you know, spend hours and hours trying to recreate the wheel, when you when you can rely on on coaches who have honed their craft or for many, many, many years? And I do that? Absolutely. You know, I’m a big believer in working with coaches and, and, you know, talking to people have done it successfully. And I don’t feel like I’m doing it alone. I feel like I have the support of fantastic people. And I’m supportive, you know, big network. And that’s been fantastic. But it’s definitely contributed to my success.


Steve Fretzin  [27:28]

Well, listen, we are kind of at the tail end of things. And I just want to thank you again for being on the show. And we’ll come back in a minute, but everyone knows that we end the show with the three best stuff and we’re going to do the three best, a little more broad, we’re going to do the best three Best of Fort Lauderdale slash Florida, where you’re down there enjoying the sun when we’re freezing up here in Chicago. So I’m coming down to visit you I definitely have to make a Florida run at some point soon. I’ve got West Coast connections in Naples, and I’ve got East Coast connections in Miami and Fort Lauderdale. And I need to do a Ron at some point. I’m gonna take you out for dinner, and we’re going to have a night. All right. So where were we going?


Jennifer Bullock  [28:07]

So I’m gonna make you travel a bit. But I know you’ve had many guests who have been in Miami who have been my Miami lawyers giving Miami recommended restaurant recommendation. So I’m going to take you a little bit out of the way but it’s worth worth it. It’s a restaurant in Tampa called Burn Steakhouse. It’s pretty well known. It’s it’s been around for over 60 years family owned it. It’s really all about the experience. So we started the episode by talking about the client experience. This is about the restaurant experience. Yeah, well, it’s Steakhouse, more of a traditional Steakhouse, you have to get reservations months in advance. They’re hard to come by, but well worth it. The food is excellent. You know, the waiters are knowing known as being the best. They have a tremendous wine collection at one point and it may still be true. They have the largest wine cellar in the United States for the wine collection of over half a million bottles 500 different labels and a $30,000 bottle of wine. But what’s really neat is they give you a tour, everybody who comes into the restaurant and eats steaks for dinner is offered a tour. And when they give you a tour, they take you to the back kitchen, they show you how all the food is prepared all the different side sections of the kitchen. You can do a tour of the wine cellar, they talk about their wine collection, a little bit of the history, and it’s just really unique. The other really unique, unique aspect of the restaurant is they have a dessert room. And if you can’t get a reservation to the restaurant itself, you just go in and go to the dessert room. They have 48 little private rooms that make up the dessert room with over 50 Desserts on the menu. They also have a piano player and so you have a phone in each of those little private rooms where you can call the piano player and make a special request. And the fun aspect especially if you bring kids is trying to stump the piano player. It’s pretty much impossible to stop Pinot you can come up with some crazy song, a Justin Bieber, you know, any theme song for a TV show and he will be able to play it. Wow. I you know, Burns is just a really unique experience and I definitely recommend it in terms of other fun things to do in South Florida. Something on the water, paddleboarding is a lot of fun, very relaxing, and then maybe not as relaxing but certainly exciting. You go to Miami Beach and rent a jet ski or wave runner and you can do a tour of those islands where all the celebrities live, you can get pretty close on a wave runner or jet ski. And that’s a lot of fun.


Steve Fretzin  [30:36]

Yeah, and I know, you know, if I come down there with my family and my son in particular, you know, we’ll be fishing we’ll figure out you know, where to fish and all that. Is that what what are the locals into? What are what are you guys up to, you know, pandemic, you know, friendly stuff that you guys are doing to kind of keep busy and stay interested? Well,


Jennifer Bullock  [30:53]

the weather’s great now. So we’re doing lots of outdoor stuff, anything outdoors, you know, I’m a runner. So find me out outside running, there’s races and lots of things going on outdoors. We’ve got carnivals and, and things in the local parks. But it’s you know, for many of you up north, it’s not a great time to be outdoors. But we’re our weather’s, you know, 60s today. And it’s just perfect. So anything outdoors, even if you’re just taking a walk on the beach is


Steve Fretzin  [31:20]

beautiful. Awesome. Awesome. Well, listen, Jennifer, thanks again for being my friend for being such a great guest on my podcast. And I know we’ve got a lot more to do together moving forward. Just you know, you’re you’re terrific.


Jennifer Bullock  [31:33]

Thank you. Thanks for having me, Steve. Yeah. Hey, and thank


Steve Fretzin  [31:37]

you everybody for listening. And hopefully you got some good takeaways from today, I’d done my usual page and notes on my remarkable to a notepad, paper free and I need to pick them up as a sponsor. So maybe at some point, they’ll someone will contact me. But anyway, I’m waiting. And just lastly, I have a new book out for those of you who are interested in doing a good read, I’ve got a new book called legal business development isn’t rocket science. And if you have always thought that it is I’m telling you it’s not so there’s 50 Plus chapters, over 250 takeaways. So check that out on Amazon, you can just type my name in or type in the title and you will find that book and I’m happy to you know, send you a free ebook. if that’s more your style. Just email me at and I will shoot you a book all about helping you be that lawyer someone who is organized and committed and looking to be a rainmaker. That’s what it’s all about everybody, take care be safe be well, we’ll talk again soon.


Narrator  [32:36]

Thanks for listening to be that lawyer, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Visit Steve’s website For additional information, and to stay up to date on the latest legal business development and marketing trends. For more information and important links about today’s episode, check out today’s show notes