In this episode, Steve Fretzin and Nequosha Anderson discuss:
- Cultivating relationships to reach your end goal.
- The important aspects of building and maintaining relationships.
- Creating conversations with those in spaces where you want to be.
- The benefits to being a disruptor in your space.
- You have to follow through and maintain top of mind with your clients and those in your network.
- Connect with people on more than just one level. Cultivating relationships long term allows you to build what you want to have.
- Cultivating relationships will open doors that, not only can you not open on your own, you may not even be able to touch it otherwise.
- Understand where your focus is and cast your net there and you will find those clients that you want to see and work with.
“It is definitely about cultivating relationships. That’s how you succeed, especially in any service based industry. You don’t even have to be the best practitioner, you just need to be the best person that can be remembered for that thing. And that’s all about how you make people feel.” — Nequosha Anderson
Connect with Nequosha Anderson:
Connect with Steve Fretzin:
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Facebook: Fretzin, Inc.
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Call Steve directly at 847-602-6911
Show notes by Podcastologist Chelsea Taylor-Sturkie
Audio production by Turnkey Podcast Productions. You’re the expert. Your podcast will prove it.
people, lawyer, relationships, business, listen, client, person, practice, cultivate, branded, knew, orlando, talk, nice, reactivated, steve, students, government, work, disrupter
Narrator, Steve Fretzin, Nequosha
It is definitely about cultivating relationships and and that’s how you succeed, especially in any service based industry is not you can’t be you don’t even have to be the best practitioner. You just need to be the best person that can be remembered for that thing. And that’s all about how you make people feel.
You’re listening to be that lawyer, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Each episode, your host, author and lawyer coach, Steve Fretzin, will take a deeper dive, helping you grow your law practice in less time, greater results. Now, here’s your host, Steve Fretzin.
Steve Fretzin [00:44]
Hey, everybody, welcome to be that lawyer. I am Steve Fretzin, your host and I hope that you’re having a wonderful day. Listen, you know me, you know, this show. It’s all about being that lawyer, someone who’s competent, organized in a skilled Rainmaker, in every single episode, my goal in it doesn’t always happen to maybe the degree we’d like it to. But my goal is to get you tactical, actionable ideas and tips and in thoughts about how to become a better lawyer, how to build a stronger practice, how to make sure that you have a sustainable, repeatable system for how you’re doing your marketing, your business development, how you’re managing your time. And I And again, I tried to bring on guests that are going to add value. And today I’ve got one that’s going to blow your mind, the Kosha. Hill Anderson is a lawyer podcast host. And she actually came up with a quote today, the quote of the day, if you will, and I’m going to read it, and then we’re going to talk about it, okay. And it’s from Helen Keller, the best and most beautiful things in the world cannot be seen or even touched, they must be felt with the heart. And that’s a really warm and fuzzy one. So what is what does that mean to you?
Hi, Steve, thank you for having me, that quote means a lot to me, because it’s the type of feeling I want my client to have, when they come to me, I want them to experience the things and feel good about engaging with a business intellectual property lawyer, oftentimes coming on and bringing on legal, most people have achy, icky feelings about it, they’re tired, they’re already, you know, feeling some way. So if I can ease that process, and ease them through it with educating them and making sure that they are okay. It’s the same equivalent of having good bedside manner, if you are a doctor or a surgeon, you want that person, you hold that patient’s hand and you hold their loved ones hand and you say, Look, I got this, I do this all the time. And I’m going to take care of your family member, hey, client, I got this, I have the experience in protecting brands. And we’re going to do this, I’m going to be with you. Yeah. And we know changes.
Steve Fretzin [02:41]
We know we can we can see things we can touch things. And that’s great. But when we feel things like when when I can get a client results, and they can tell me the results. And I’m happy with the results. So they just locked up a new piece of business, that’s all great. But they tell me how they feel about our experience working together or our shared experience and working together to lock up business. To me that’s like what makes my heart sore and makes me happy. It’s not just the academics of things. It’s really more about the feeling and the emotional tie that I have with my family, my clients, you know, my community, things like that. That’s what that kind of means to me. Yeah, exactly.
So that is why I thought that that would be a good quote, and thank you for allowing me to select it.
Steve Fretzin [03:22]
Yeah, you’re the first person that selected their own UI. And I think I might make that a regular thing. So
very, very man disrupting the space already.
Steve Fretzin [03:31]
You are. So let’s, let’s get let’s get into the weeds a little bit about your background and how you came to be not only as a terrific lawyer, but someone that has really been a disrupter and also really pushed yourself to to learn and execute on marketing strategies to grow your practice that most lawyers would shy away from.
So I have been a practicing lawyer for nine, nearly 10 years now. Okay, you gotta you got to do the math. Yeah. Carry the one. So I’ve been practicing for a little while I started off in business intellectual property. My mentor was a former universal and Disney council. So I’d learned a lot about business and IP from him. And based upon my foundation of knowing how to build the relationship, I was able to secure that job before I even graduated law school. Wonderful is more nice to the economy kind of shifted, you know, that? Oh, 809 wasn’t the greatest. And so as a result of that, I went back to what I knew before I was doing Law School, which was government. So I went back into government practice I knew and based upon the relationships and the feelings that I had, I was able to secure another government job, and you’ll see the common theme here. So I worked there and did really great things and service my clients as best as I possibly can, but we all know government, that feeling of just you get burned out a little bit and your health suffers. So as a result of that, I had to transition away from working in government and went back into private practice. And back into private practice, I went back to my foundation, cultivate relationships and make peace and go with that. And that is what’s been servicing me since I reactivated my practice.
Steve Fretzin [05:15]
Now, before we go any further, I want to just get a little more detail about when you say develop relationships, what are some things that you find to be really important in developing relationships, whether it’s to find that job to get that client to deal in government to move out of government? Relationships, right, so what what are some of the things that are are top of mind for you on that?
Top of mind for me is following up and not literally doing what you say you’re going to do it? For instance, Steve, I see. You may be a Chicago Bulls fan. So if I see something that’s related to Chicago, Bill, bulls memorabilia, hey, let me take a picture of this. Hey, Steve, just thinking of you guy saw this. Hope you’re having a great day. You’re like, Hey, Nicole, she remembered I liked the Chicago Bulls. Oh, that was really nice of her. So next time, you see somebody who says, Hey, I got an Ip Man, somebody’s taking my stuff. I got the perfect person for you. Let me let me send her a message. Let me send the crucial message because she she’s she’s good, man. She’s good.
Steve Fretzin [06:20]
Okay, so it’s so it’s connecting with them on something personal to them.
Yes, and or connecting our relationships or something. And not just when I want something is literally cultivating a relationship does long term. And even if you never refer me or anything, I know that you’re a good person, like I’m gravitating towards good people, because that’s who I want around me. And that’s who will bring me good people for me to service. You see, I’m building what I want to have. And that’s all about relationships. I think your book, which I read is all about that it is definitely about cultivating relationships. And and that’s how you succeed, especially in any service based industry. It’s not you can’t you don’t even have to be the best practitioner. You just need to be the best person that can be remembered for that thing. And that’s all about how you made people feel. Yeah,
Steve Fretzin [07:13]
well, we’re going back to that go back to feeling right. That’s where things are. So you know what you know about someone’s great and that’s, that can help you but it’s how ultimately, you connect on a feeling connect on an emotional level that really, you know, puts things together and makes them remember you and want to help you want to send work your way. Yep, Stacy brown Randall talks about this too. So yeah, I’ve heard her she’s Yeah, she’s terrific. Stacy’s amazing.
So it’s one of those things where it goes back to the basics. If you want to grow your firm, go back to the basics, why you can’t say I’m the best PR lawyer, I’m the best criminal lawyer, I’m the best business lawyer. Okay, that doesn’t disrupt the narrative that doesn’t make me want to refer you. But if I remember that your your son, and my son is on the same T ball, Lee. And every time you brought the oranges, and you were there, and I knew that you’re a criminal lawyer, hey, I don’t listen, I don’t do criminal but I know somebody who does. And I’m gonna think of you as the person who brought the oranges for the T ball League, because I know how my kid felt about getting those oranges. And you were pretty decent human being. I don’t even know if you’re really a good criminal lawyer. But it doesn’t matter. It was top of mine. It was the way you made me feel. If that doesn’t,
Steve Fretzin [08:27]
that’s really great. And in so those relationships allowed you to change and shift your practice. So what point did you go solo and build your own IP practice?
So when I left law school, I worked with my mentor, but I also had my firm right off the gate. So I was one of those people who started right off the gate. And I he allowed me to model it after his, if that makes sense. Okay, sure. And then I went into government. And then in May of this year, 2021, I reactivated my private practice after leaving government, okay. And what made me want to do it was one, I saw some things coming from my parents started their businesses when I was like, 1314. So I got exposed to business. And I’m talking big business, my dad is in transportation, logistics, and my mom’s an accountant who came from a medical background. So she had a bedside manner, nurturing very good at what she did. And that and I got exposed to that at an early age. And that carried on for me in high school that carried on for me in college. I was a high schooler, who were volunteering for the teachers in the admin team. And when I got 18, I was able to get a job right at for the government locally, because of the relationships I was building when I was in high school with the people who were my teachers, or my admin, you have to cultivate relationships at such an early age because that’s what’s gonna carry you. That’s what’s going to open up doors for you. Yeah, you can’t even physically touch, if that makes sense.
Steve Fretzin [09:54]
Well, and something that we’ve had talked about on the show is the lack of awareness. from law school students to realize the person sitting to your left or to your right, in 10 years is going to be a GC at a company you may want to get into. And you may want to start to identify not only who you like, but who you get along with, and who is who’s kind of like a star per student, because those relationships that are developed then will, if you continue to hold them and and work them in a positive way, they’re going to they’re going to pay out down the road. And I don’t think they’re really doing enough of
that. I don’t think law students are definitely not doing enough of that prime example. I just spoke with some law students, right. And I extended an invitation to them. Hey, if you have questions, I am an open book. Here’s my email. Here’s my phone number text me whatever, right? How many of those actually followed up with me?
Steve Fretzin [10:45]
I’m gonna get 00. Yeah. Because I’ve been there. I’ve spoken to five or six different law schools and talk to their, you know, their students about networking and business development. I’ve offered free books, I’ve offered free advice. Yeah, it’s it’s I don’t know, I don’t know what’s going on there. But it’s, it’s not it’s not it’s not a good sign.
Now, it’s a little scary to me, because it then comes out, well, I can’t find a job or I can’t do this. What did you do to cultivate that? The reason why I left law school with a job was because I knew I had a very strong interest in intellectual property technology things because I came from a computer programming and type background and undergrad. So I knew that this is the lane that I wanted to be in. So I cultivated a relationship with my professor. And Express, hey, this is what I know I want to do. I went to her hours to ask questions. Even if I didn’t have a question. I still wanted to get clarification because hey, she writes to test. And if I learned what she wants is emphasise to her, then boom, I’m already ahead on my outline. No, oh, yeah. One, two, she saw the interest that I was having. And guess what she started inviting me to some of her private events, where other practitioners would be. So I got invited, I ended up networking in the space, I didn’t just attach to her hip, I actually went out and introduced myself in the room. And the practitioner who later offered me a job, who was later my long term mentor, was like, I really liked you, hey, when you come home for Christmas break, hit me up. So you, I was like, Sure, I would love to follow you around. This was my thing, I would love to follow you around and just be a fly on the wall. Even if that means I just have to staple paper clips together, get it staple paper clips together. If you’re listening. Even if I got I will be as quiet as a mouse, I just want to be in this space. He was like, Well, I’m a virtual firm. So that was different for me to I don’t have a brick and mortar. And if you I just go to different my clients and meet them. So if you want to follow around me, that’s fine. I don’t know how exciting is gonna be. It was the best day of my life. It changed it. And as a result of my interest, he gave me a writing assignment during Christmas break. And as a result of that writing assignment, I’ve been working with him. Yeah. Do you see how
Steve Fretzin [13:09]
Yeah, oh, yeah, I see how you did it. Yeah, you’re you’re sneaky, clever. And, you know, I talked to lawyers too, about, you know, they want to get in front of general counsel’s and they don’t know how to make the ask, or they don’t know how to approach it. And I, I advised them on occasion to say, you know, look, can we just get together, I’m interested in learning from you, I’d like advice on on what you’re looking for in a private practice, you know, partner where you would send work, you’re not saying I want the work. I want advice. I’m interested in learning how you select outside firms. And in doing so they they get that seat at the table to have that conversation. Hopefully, it’s a love fest. And the next thing you know, they’re, you know, they’re they have a new relationship that didn’t have yesterday,
agreed. And I think also you can say, what is one thing that makes you angry about the firms that you hire out the most, then you can learn what they are doing wrong. So if that you know that that’s what you want to do, you can do the opposite. And then you can learn where they’re going wrong. And you can show how you’re different you can space. Yeah, people will, they may not tell you all the good, but they’ll tell you the bad news, right? If you listen, you want to get a housewife talking, tell her about her husband, and take the garbage out and last three cycles, okay? So it’s one of those things where you if you know, you want to be in the General Counsel’s Office of IBM or our, I don’t know, Microsoft or Thomson brooder or whatever, find where they are, find out what they do and just say, Hey, I am not asking for a job or internship. I literally just want to know, what are some things you typically look for? I’m a law student here. I saw you spoke Ma’am, this is the key. You can’t just go for the ask. You got to let the person know that you’ve done their research. So I’ve seen that you spoke at this particular conference, and I tried to get tickets, but they sold out or they didn’t have a law student thing. So I couldn’t get your speech. But according to the agenda, you talked about blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. There you have it.
Steve Fretzin [15:16]
It’s all Yeah. So it’s, it’s you just have to be it’s like, same thing with LinkedIn, like someone will send me a LinkedIn request. And I don’t know where it’s coming from, or why. And then I’ll get another one that is specific to, you know, my Michael Jordan, Jersey behind me that people talk about, as you mentioned, or that, hey, they, you know, they really enjoyed listening to a podcast or, you know, whatever. And then then it’s like, oh, yeah, so this is someone I want to connect with? Because they you took
the time. Yeah, that’s the most precious resource we have is time. And if I’ve found out that you took some of your precious resources on me, yeah, that’s major for me, that makes me feel good. See, you made me feel good on the inside, because it’s like, of all the things you could then reading about listening or doing. You took the time to figure out what I was doing in the world. Okay, I need to talk to you. And then because, and usually sometimes can that can be manipulated. So you have to have your discernment. But in the law firm, Phil, we always like, well, I want to get referrals, and I want people to refer me for this. Who are you following up with your referral partners? Do they have something going on that someone could be a good fit for? Like if they, if you see they’re struggling with their graphics? Hey, I saw you got a new marketing campaign, I just linked up with such and such, and they did really good on my graphics you want to? I’m gonna send an eve introduction for you. So you guys can link up I think they’ll be really good. So that’s you referring them to somebody else without telling them? Hey, your graphics suck. But in a nice, I know, that their graphics have been, you know, you paid attention to their campaign. Yeah. You know, you see how I did that?
Steve Fretzin [16:55]
Yeah, yeah, I yeah, I totally agree with you. And again, if you can, you know, I’ll pick up on someone doesn’t have a website that is secure, or I’ll pick up on their LinkedIn profile is, is really not supportive of their brand. Now, and I’m not criticizing, I’m saying, Look, I’ve observed this, I’m happy to offer some help or advice, or I’d love to at least, you know, share with you a couple thoughts. If you’re open to having a conversation. And generally they are and they appreciate it. You know, somebody’s website, I found people’s websites who are down and they don’t even know it, like, Oh, my God, that’s where I’m getting my leads from. And I didn’t even know it was down. Yeah. So I’m, you know, trying to help
you be that lawyer. That’s how you stand out. That is how you, you know, get those referrals. And that’s how your clients remember, like, if I’m business for me, and attention to my business client, renewal anniversary, and sending them Hey, happy anniversary for your business, or something, or just I’m very big on stationery and getting things in the mail and sending things in the mail. So it’s not just my branded stuff. People don’t want your branded stuff. Okay. They, they, we all have that box with everybody’s branded stuff. It just kind of is there. Stop doing that. You want to stop doing that. But make it a little bit more. Hey, I saw you are planning a trip to Paris. I went there three, three years ago. Here’s a list of some people that are places that I went, I hope you enjoy your time. Yeah, it can be on like your stationery, whatever. But it’s a more personalized thing to let a person know that you’re thinking of them or something like that. Well, yeah,
Steve Fretzin [18:35]
I mean, I can tell you on one hand, how many thank you cards I’ve gotten in a given year. It’s it’s it’s sort of, you know, something that just isn’t done very often or at all anymore. And I think it’s a misstep, because I that’s what people are looking for is again that that private touch of something unique, something that unique that said some warm regards, that are personal, not you know, I used to send out $100 Cookie gift baskets, and I knew they were delicious, because I tested them before I had to test them before I sent them out. Not out of the actual package. I was sending you know, others but nobody said thank you. Nobody’s nobody seemed to really care me, they got him they put him in the office and people you know, I’m sure you know, just just you know, you know, used to like a buffet of cookies. But, but thank you notes, handwritten with warm regard seem to get a better reaction from people. And so it costs a lot less just takes my time.
That’s it. And the immunity goes back to what I said that most valuable resources time. Yeah, you took that time, your client is going to feel it like I heard the other day on a podcast. I’ll have to link it to you. But I heard the other day about someone who shared the same sentiment about that branded stuff. But the person was a PII lawyer, and they help people who had like surgery issues related issues, so they knew they had to go to surgery, and they sent a care package post surgery, didn’t have anything to do with their brand but it was soup and bandages and ice packs and stuff like that just post the surgery. I bet that client remember that care package versus they remember that mug with your logo on it.
Steve Fretzin [20:11]
Yeah, yeah, I got it. I got it unless it say, a yeti mug and then it’s okay, because I think
people got some Yeti. Kind of like enough but it doesn’t fit it doesn’t fit in my cup holder. No. So that’s why I got to feel some type of way but this is what happens when you have a German car.
Steve Fretzin [20:32]
They got they got small cupholders in Germany.
I don’t know even Yeti cup I got this is a tangent. The Yeti cup I got has a handle thing. Oh god.
Steve Fretzin [20:43]
I’m talking about one of these, like, just the standard, you know, oh, well, yeah, a coffee. Yeah, those are such you know,
the the Yeti ones with the handle. And,
Steve Fretzin [20:52]
ya know, those are no good for the for
the car to drive around, you know, the wrong bump and boom, you know, got a lawsuit.
Steve Fretzin [21:01]
No problem. Well, let me let’s let’s transition to a topic that I think is sort of one of the main themes of our conversation today. And I think lawyers are slowly picking up on this, the idea that not only authenticity, and how important that is, but being a disruptor in the space doing doing and saying things different than everyone else, and how that really benefits growing a law practice. So can you talk about your thoughts on being a disrupter, and then what you’re doing to be a disrupter and how that’s benefited you and your practice.
Most definitely, you have to disrupt the space in order to stand out, you cannot continue with the same thing that we were all taught in law school is not going to work. I’m here to tell you, it is not going to work, you will miss out on opportunities, and you’re gonna burn yourself out. Because you’re going to be spinning the wheel, I wanted to keep things that I am doing to disrupt the space is definitely narrowing my focus on who I want to work with. And where are they and go where they are. I want to work primarily with women content creators who utilize the internet to deliver their goods or service to where are these women, mostly on foot in Facebook groups? My people are in Facebook groups that are geared towards women in business. And what do I do? I go in there and I be a value. I don’t go in there and say, Hey, I’m better than another guy. How come? No, hey, I just someone just did a huge Pio. And they didn’t give me my net 30. What am I supposed to do? Hey, of course, you’re here. I can’t give you any personalized advice unless we become a client. But can you go back to your terms and conditions? And what it is say? Send them an email and find that paragraph and then see, come back and tell us? Yeah, Oh, damn. The closure. I sent that and it didn’t work. What’s my next steps? Girl book a console.
Steve Fretzin [22:53]
Talk to me.
And then or you do talks like go live? Like I have a series on YouTube called the business lawyer said, and I go live. And I and I repurpose my content. So this is a twofer. Answer. This is how I’m disrupting this space. Yeah, go live on Instagram. I take that video. And then I repurpose it for YouTube. Same video didn’t didn’t create anything new. Yeah. Put it on YouTube. So now I’m on two platforms with the same name all directing back to my firm. Yeah, you have to disrupt the space that whole if I just go network with my fellow compadres. That’s all I have to do. No, you have to go where the people are.
Steve Fretzin [23:36]
Yeah. But you But you’ve identified not only your targets and the kind of work you want to do, which I think most attorneys are throwing a huge huge net out instead of instead of a you know, a fishing line in that’s going to get you who you want. And then you’re you know, where those people are, you’re going to where they are and then you’re interacting and engaging with them. Yeah, and this is this is this is these are things that just aren’t happening for most attorneys. They’re still playing by the old rulebook, which is you know, going to a networking groups or, which is fine. I mean, again, if that still works, but it’s just not it’s not as highly targeted as what you’re talking about.
Nope. And that’s the key you you have to think about the way Amazon or Facebook seems to know what you were searching and yes, they have some practices that are very questionable with data mining and all that. But think about that feeling when you they like they just knew what I like they just had it had it it’s the same thing you want to know if think about that person that you just adore working with, like you would just go to the moon and the stars to get their stuff done as quickly as possible. Because they are the best client they pay. They don’t really they don’t harass you if they see your question You’re quick to answer because you know how they are. Find those people because they are more of those people in the world. And you don’t want to be like Deadliest Catch you know how you talking about casting your net that loves that show? So it was like Deadliest Catch They put the lions out there. And they you saw the people that had to pick out the stuff that wasn’t what they wanted with the crabs and stuff. It’s the same thing, you got to pick out the people you don’t want in your net. But if you just casting it out there, not knowing where the crabs are, in this particular example, yeah, you’re gonna get some stuff you don’t want. Yeah.
Steve Fretzin [25:19]
So by having the narrow focus, and we can call that niche specialization, and then you’ve taken it even further, where it isn’t just a nice, it’s almost like a niche within a niche. And I’ve done that, too. Like I’m working with lawyers. I’m not working with law firms. Right? I’m working with lawyer, individual lawyers that so so I can go anywhere I want in the country and find lawyers. That’s no problem. But it’s not I’m not targeting law firms. So that’s off the table. I’m not targeting in house people that’s off the table. So like, it’s it is really, and then it’s only ambitious, interested attorneys are my clients. So that’s like, again, a subset of a subset of a subset. And that’s where I’m, that’s where I’m spending my time.
right. And then all you need to do that.
You do you have to in order to survive, it’s sort of like that, we all use this example, if you’re in the consulting space, I do business consulting. So this is where I kind of let them know. But it’s sort of like the doctor analogy. You have a general practitioner doctor, and then you have your knee specialist. Yeah, the knee specialist is making a little bit more money. And the general practitioner and it sure doesn’t mean that they’re not great doctors, but that knee specialist, I’m going to the knee specialist, if my knee hurts, I’m searching knee doctor needs specialty meats, don’t help me, please. But if you are a knee specialist, who only deals with certain type of breaks in the knee, you’re super niche, you’re super hyper focused on that one particular aspect of the knee. That’s kind of like what you’re doing. And and that’s exactly what I’m doing.
Steve Fretzin [26:49]
Yeah, you given up the ankle, and you’re given up the back and some of the other things, but you know what, so what, because you’re not going to be known for everything. I’d rather be known for something that I do extremely well with a set group of people than sort of not being known at all through a large group of people. And that’s, that’s a lesson that some people have to learn the hard way. I think I did for a while. But you know, you also have to prove it out. I think some people need proof and evidence that there’s that target exists and that that target is going to help them then they may have to test in the waters a bit before pushing chips in. Right?
I would Yeah, I would definitely say this, I could be an example number one, I left government at the end of April due to some health reasons, like I was almost on near death. So I reactivated the practice. But I started putting more work into it by like June or July. So that were so by June and July. And by the end of this year, when you’re listening to this episode, I can honestly say I’ve made in revenue, not take home just revenue, six figures nice. Just with this strategy. Yeah. So it can be done. If you are hyper focused, it can be done. And if you put the right things, the strategies in place before you start knowing you got to know what you want to do how you want to do it, and you execute and then you analyze and make and tweak as you go, you’ll be fine. You’ll be fine. There are there are so many people with so many legal problems in this world. Do not let the people think, oh my god, they’re pushing out so many lawyers are at the moment. That listen, you know how many doctors you know how many, like if he like, trust me, just trust this process. Trust the process. Wax on wax off. If you build it, if you do it the right way. It will work out and I’m not saying it’s gonna be you know, sunny skies all day. I’m not saying that but have a strategy. And you will be okay. Yeah.
Steve Fretzin [28:43]
Well, really brilliant. I appreciate you know, your wisdom and the lessons you’ve learned and talking about relationships and the importance of those and being a disrupter. And then how your repurposing I mean, there’s just a lot of really great gems that people that are listening should be taking away. We do have to move to the three best Have you ready for that?
Steve Fretzin [29:03]
no, you’re not ready. No. We’re going forward anyway. Okay, we’re in the you’re in Orlando Orlando area.
I’m in the Orlando area.
Steve Fretzin [29:12]
Okay. All right. Now here we go. And we had a little chat about this ahead of time and listen, it is what it is. You’re gonna do fine. So favorite restaurant in Orlando.
Okay, I’m gonna get slack for this but my favorite restaurant in Orlando is California Pizza Kitchen at the millennia a mall that’s our higher end mall where Gucci and Louie Vuitton and Neiman Marcus is gloomy. There there’s a it is a chain restaurant. Hear me out yes chain restaurant. However the I have been going there for the past 15 plus years and I’ve developed a relationship with the GMs there, the weight the server staff there, and these people are integrated in my life to the point where they were involved in my birthday celebrations. My wedding celebration, they provided the food for my wedding, my pre wedding thing so yeah, They, yes, it’s a chain, but this particular location is home for me. It’s home for me.
Steve Fretzin [30:05]
Well, listen, that’s what matters. And if you can find a restaurant where you feel at home and you feel like everyone knows your name, and you have that relationship, the food can be amazing. The food could be good. You may not care, because you’ve got again, back to relationships and how it makes you feel, right. Yeah.
So shout out to Todd and the crew there. There we go.
Steve Fretzin [30:25]
There we go. And so people traveling to Orlando, I mean, there’s the obvious answer of what people do in Orlando, right. Anything anything that other than that that you recommend or is that sort of the go to in Orlando,
and most people are going to the touristy district, but I encourage people to come up a little bit come to the Winter Park area, come to our winter garden area. Come to our downtown area, there are a lot of hidden gems, especially downtown. We have the historic Paramore district. We can have museums there. That’s one of the first black areas edenville is a historic black town when 1887 established. I hope I think it’s 1887 they are getting they’ll correct me if I’m
Steve Fretzin [31:07]
wrong. The history historians are listening right now will me yeah Back to you. But there’s
a lot of places you can go there outside of our touristy district and you can get an exceptional experience. There’s a pancake place at one on one our state parks you can make pancakes on a griddle and see manatees like just explore Florida Florida is is badass.
Steve Fretzin [31:25]
Yeah. Oh doubt. No doubt, no doubt. And then what are you and others doing for fun recreation relaxation these days.
Now for me, I can I can speak love.
Steve Fretzin [31:35]
Let’s talk about you. That’s okay.
I can say for me, I am spending a lot of time with my family. So especially with COVID I have some compromised people so I just really been spending some time with family. But I do enjoy going to our brunch scenes, though. There’s another restaurant called the stubborn mule downtown. They have these cheesy Gouda grits. Oh,
Steve Fretzin [31:56]
ooh, that sounds nice. I have some I have some southern blooded me by the way. So I appreciate that as much as anybody
listen if you know grits, these the grits and I so I would say stubborn mule. Great place love them. They’re downtown like Yola, so you can get out and and all that. So if you’re in Orlando, go to the stubborn mule.
Steve Fretzin [32:19]
Alright, that’s the alternative to the Pizza Kitchen is what you’re saying? Yes, yeah, I’d
Steve Fretzin [32:25]
It covered your bases is what I think is going on here. Hey, listen, thank you so much for being my guest. And, and I just so happy that we were able to meet and I hope we can continue the relationship beyond today. And that’s my that’s my goal. If people want to get in touch with you for work advice, thoughts on being disrupter? How do they get in touch with you?
Mainly on Instagram. So I spent a lot of time on Instagram, my handle, there is Esquire 44. If you want some book a consult or any of those things, the links are there. You can also visit my website, which is Anderson law. fl.com.
Steve Fretzin [33:00]
Fantastic. Well, thank you again, I really appreciate it. And I’m looking forward to, you know, hearing what people think about about our interview and get some feedback on that. And I just think I just think you’re delightful. This was just a pleasure.
Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, my pleasure. And
Steve Fretzin [33:15]
hey, everybody, thank you for spending some time with us today. And listen, at the end of the day, you know, you get a couple takeaways you execute on the field. Be that lawyer someone who’s confident organized a skilled Rainmaker, and continue to develop what you’re doing and take in fresh ideas. And I know you’re going to be successful, so just keep up on it. Thank you, everybody. Take care of your safety. Well, we’ll talk soon.
Thanks for listening to be that lawyer, life changing strategies and resources for growing a successful law practice. Visit Steve’s website fretzin.com. For additional information, and to stay up to date on the latest legal business development and marketing trends. For more information and important links about today’s episode, check out today’s show notes